Ep 15 Finding God in Your Longing

Today we’re offering an example of what one might experience during a Spiritual Direction session. In this particular session, Kristina is bringing a dream to Chris.  

 “I felt discombobulated…I was trying to get somewhere.” 

 …”I’m in a time of figuring things out. What does life look like now?” 

 We invite you to join us as Kristina works through her dream with Chris. And if you’re interested in learning more about spiritual companionship for yourself, please email us: info@thecontemplativelife.net. 

#SpiritualCompanioning
#SpirtitualDirection
#Dreams

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Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

dream, longing, podcast, spiritual direction, spiritual companion

Dominic Kaiser  00:06

Welcome to The Contemplative Life: Three pastors, friends and spiritual companions help us explore spirituality through a contemplative lens.

I'm Christina Roberts.

I'm Chris Roberts.

I'm Kristina Kaiser. We're glad you joined us.

Christina Roberts  00:23

Hi, it's great to be with you. Today on the podcast, we are going to be doing something a little different. We thought it might be interesting to give an example of what one might find were you to seek out a spiritual companioning/spiritual direction session. So Kristina Kaiser is going to be the Seeker today, while Chris Roberts has the role of Spiritual Director. 

Before we begin, we want to offer a couple of notes. First of all, in a real life session, typically they are closer to one hour, so we are truncating it for the purpose of the podcast. Also, in real life, there tends to be opportunity at the beginning of the session to hold silence and some sort of prayer at the end. And again, we're eliminating that for the recording. And finally, probably the most noteworthy is that, usually, when you go to a direction session, it is confidential. Confidentiality is held in very high esteem, and of course, today, Kristina Kaiser is willing to share this broadly. 

She is actually going to be bringing a dream to Chris today, which isn't necessarily super common, but it does happen every once in a while. And so they have edited their conversation to just share the dream part. And I invite you to notice how Chris, as he is, quote, "directing" Kristina, he's really encouraging her to keep going deeper into her own sense of what God might be saying to her through these different symbols and noticings in the dream. So on that note, we hope you enjoy the podcast.

Chris Roberts  01:59

Maybe we can start with any significant God moments that you had the past couple of weeks.

Kristina Kaiser  02:06

Well, I had this huge dream the other day, and I don't usually have dreams that mean anything to me. But this one felt like it lasted a while. And when I woke up, I felt like this is, this is a story. This is about what's been happening and what's about to happen. And I've really been...like I sat for a couple hours at the piano that morning because I just felt like I needed to continue to explore that space. And it just continues to feel very real to me

Chris Roberts  02:37

A dream is speaking to your soul. Tell me more about what you feel like it's saying.

Kristina Kaiser  02:42

It started with feeling a little discombobulated, like, several days had gone by, and I couldn't remember them. And I was trying to...I was telling people like, "I remember Monday, and now it's Friday. And I don't remember any of the days in between." 

And then it continued on, like suddenly, I was carrying this baby. And I was trying to get somewhere, and it was getting dark. And I was going,, like up a ramp, but then you had to go down the ramp. So I was thinking, "This is so weird! You're going backwards to go forwards. This is supposed to, like, make it faster, and it got very narrow. And like very few people could have squeezed into that downward staircase. And, but I got through and then some people were running away, and then others, I was seeming to gain on and I thought like, "How could I be gaining on anybody when I'm going I'm holding this baby? How is it possible to be able to go faster?" But then that person seemed to be chasing me? Well, they tried to put a cloth over my head. So I couldn't see. And I was like, "Can you please not do that?" [Laughing] In a very non-direct way that is not me, "Can you please not do that?" 

And then I was taken somewhere, and then it was a new day. There were all of these people around, and I couldn't really see the person next to me. But it felt like that person was, like, the essence of these things that I had really appreciated in another person, like equality, and treating everybody according to their, like, you have this gift and you have the strength, and so I'm going to utilize that. So there was this song in my spirit. And I didn't realize the song was in my spirit till this other woman stood up to sing it. She is this person that I know very little. But I attribute compassion and generosity and kindness to her. And she started singing this song and I was like, "I don't know what the rules are right now. Like I don't know if we're allowed to sing, but I'm gonna sing that song too." So I started singing the song." 

And then the baby...The "baby," who's four-years old, came in and woke me up, so that was the end of all the things. And as I thought about it, I felt like, "You know so much of this feels like what has been." We had all these children come into our lives and it felt like a year, two years, just disappeared. And then we brought this baby in. And it definitely felt like this going back, trying to go forward. And it often feels like, "I don't know the rules. But there's these values." And I think, currently, I feel like I'm in a time of figuring out: What does it mean that we've moved, and we're closer to family, and we're still doing ministry, what does life look like now? It's this notion of like: There's this song, you're already singing it, right? And, and just joining in, like, it feels very significant to me, all to say.

Chris Roberts  05:41

Gotcha. So, in this dream, just to reflect back, maybe, some of the things that I hear you saying, some of the key elements, were this protective - having this child, and a destination. You're going somewhere. But then there's this part of the journey that is confusing to you. You're discombobulated; you don't know the way. And then the dream shifts to a different part, and there's this singing aspect, where, this person that embodies these attributes that you really hold up and lift them up. And then, you don't know the rules. But you sort of just, you sort of just go for it. And you sort of sing along. And then, I think I heard you saying, that your natural child came and woke you up from the dream, not the child in the dream. But your real child. And when you think about this dream, where is it that you feel God? Where do you experience God in those moments?

Kristina Kaiser  07:08

I think most strongly...as I'm sitting in this chair, so it's this green space. And there's like leadership, and the rules have been given. And there's a liturgy being spoken, but I don't understand. Even though the like the rules have been given, even though the liturgy has been spoken. And I'm watching it all, and I'm trying to figure out, "Okay, so I think I'm in charge or something here, right? Like I'm supposed to...that's something I'm supposed to be doing." And then there's other people that are clearly not given permission to speak. So I've been given permission to speak. But I don't know when I'm supposed to do that. And so I think in that moment, the part that I feel the most strongly is, as I say, like, "I don't know the rules, but I'm going for it anyway," and I join with this other voice. And this joining with this other voice is like this breaking open, this freeing, lovely experience, just...right? Suddenly, you feel like you're where you're supposed to be. That moment in particular...

And relief. Yeah. Yeah. 

Chris Roberts  08:17

So stepping out ,that was a moment of freedom. And...And experiencing God in that moment, okay.

Kristina Kaiser  08:29

Yeah. Because everything else feels a little uncertain. Right? I feel nervous and concerned, and...I just don't know. I don't understand so much, right. Yeah,that one moment, especially. 

Chris Roberts  08:42

So in the moments where you're confused, ou don't know the rules. As you picture that in your mind, those moments, where's your awareness of God in those times? Where is He for you?

Kristina Kaiser  08:53

I think it's highly cerebral in those moments, right? Because I'm...I know that I'm not fully being overtaken, right?  The person puts the cloth over my head, and I say, "Can you please not do that?" And they actually take it off. That's not supposed to happen!

So there's a sense of God's protection, even in the midst of the scariness of it, the, like: This is a really narrow stairwell that is kind of uncomfortable to go down, but I can still go down it, right? There's that, even in the pressing, there's a sense of still being able. So those things, for sure. And it feels impossible that I could go forward, that I could overtake or that I could keep up in any kind of a way...and yet I am. So there's this, kind of, miraculous sense. Those are all things that feel God-like to me, even though my emotions are a little, you know, harried.

Chris Roberts  09:52

When you say your emotions are "harried," tell me a little bit more about that. What are the predominant emotions that are coming forward? What are you thinking? What are you feeling with the emotions?

Kristina Kaiser  10:02

I feel, kind of, it's scary, really, to be like, "I don't know where I am, or what day it is, or where that time went, and to not go to get it back." So that feels scary. The uncertainty... so I'm walking, and it's dark. And I'm thinking, "How long is it going to take to get there?" There's this feeling of, just, the uncertainty is also scary. I feel a little anxious. I feel a little scared.

Chris Roberts  10:31

And as you think about God, in those moments, where is He in those moments of anxiousness and scaryness?

Kristina Kaiser  10:39

So in the early part of the dream, I'm speaking to someone. And I'm telling them, like, "I don't know what day it is." And that notion of being able to be with somebody feels important to me. Even though I'm a little bit emotionally distraught, at least I'm getting to share it with someone. So that feels very important. And even though I'm walking in the dark, there is a street light, right? It's not fully dark. So that also feels like an important part. It is dark, but it's not black. So that also...there's little...there's just enough comfort to keep walking, to keep going.

Chris Roberts  11:21

So it sounds like there's a...you're discovering a general awareness of God. It's not in the forefront, but it's in the background.

Kristina Kaiser  11:29

That's fair. Yeah, Absolutely. And I think that, that word of protecting something, right, I had attributed it very literally to the baby, which was a real protective experience, not to be diminished. But that is generally true also. That baby could be all the people that I'm thinking of. 

Chris Roberts  11:52

So the The baby has symbolism for you. It's wrapped up, there's many people wrapped up in this baby.

Kristina Kaiser  11:58

Yeah, in the dream, I actually don't see the face of the baby. They're, like, swaddled very completely. So I had initially thought of it only in terms of our actual small family unit, but we actually have lived in a very extended-family-world for a long time. So there's plenty of people and there's even plenty of other, just, things that...protection is a really big deal. Like hold...hold the baby, hold it tight! Get through whatever thing needs to be gotten through.

Chris Roberts  12:30

Are there places in your life that you feel that protection? Or maybe feel the lack of protection?

Kristina Kaiser  12:36

Yeah, probably forever. I mean, we...we have lived our lives, just in this very, like, let's try "everything and anything" kind of a way. We often jump before we know what all the things could be. And then we find out all the things as we go. So certainly, there's been, "Oh my gosh! We need to protect our relationship. We need to protect downtime. We need to keep our kids healthy, right?" There's been plenty of sickness, finances...We need to make sure that we can float financially in the midst of all the risk that we're taking. I don't want this person's feelings to be hurt. I mean, gosh, everything right? So yeah, Yeah, lots of ways that...and there's, there's a sense that I am journeying home, but I never get there. I'm ultimately transported to this green space. 

And I have had other dreams that involve this green space as coming together of people. And it's always the case that when we come together, there's this drawing to God, there's this drawing upward. It's always worship. There's always a...I don't know, I'm doing this act with my hands that people won't be able to see, but it's like "coming forth" and then "bursting upward" experience. So that feels familiar.

Chris Roberts  14:06

So, tell me more about that. I like to hear more. So you feel this about people in your life? Or this...you're doing this diagram with your hands...but what does it mean? What does it mean for you?

Kristina Kaiser  14:25

You know, it's always been a really big deal to me, this notion of: One head turns, and then another head turns, and then another head turns. And, and pretty soon, you are where you were supposed to be, right? But it's it's slow. And community has always been very important to me, which actually is always, a little bit, feels like we're chasing that notion of community, that we kind of feel like it's supposed to be there, like I don't know. 

But yes, so there's this kind of like entering in, one at a time, one at a time. And then it gets very strong as everybody gets there. And as it arrives, then it, like, bursts open, like this worshipful experience bursts open. So, I don't know. It's kind of a belief that I've definitely had about my life, .ike, somehow, we all journey to the point, right? We're all we're trying to get to that...like "one accord" has been a really big deal to me lately, this notion of, "and they were all of one mind," sort of a thing. And that big things happen once you get to that space. So...

Chris Roberts  15:49

So I'm hearing longing. There's a longing for this sense of community. Also hearing you feel like maybe there's some momentum. The heads turning, but you want more momentum. You're longing for more community?

Kristina Kaiser  16:12

Yes. Oh, my gosh, yes! You know...I have definitely, like, cried for that very thing. And we always, I think, like, we take all the little bits, right? Like, we get excited about all the little bits. And...but yes, there's something in my heart that is yet to be fulfilled. And...yes.

Chris Roberts  16:36

So why don't we just take a moment. I'd like to just take a couple of seconds, and I'd like for you to picture your heart and picture that longing that you feel. And then I'd like for you to ask yourself the question, "Where is God at in that longing?"

Kristina Kaiser  17:01

Well, I think at this particular moment, I feel a little bit like the baby. So...

I feel like God becomes me holding that baby. So like, we've kind of...right, in that sense, I'm the baby. And God is the one going down the staircase and walking down the road and saying, "Hey, don't put that that cloth over the head." 

So yeah, in that question, I feel like the roles change a little bit.

Chris Roberts  17:41

So when you pictured where God was at, you became protected?

Kristina Kaiser  17:48

Yes. Yeah. 

Chris Roberts  17:51

You were with God on His journey to a destination? 

Kristina Kaiser  17:59

Yeah. It feels different. 

Chris Roberts  18:01

So, like your longing is to be with God in this journey of...and you feel God in you're longing?

Kristina Kaiser  18:11

I do. Yeah.

Chris Roberts  18:13

And you feel you leading? God leading? 

Kristina Kaiser  18:16

Yes! Yeah, right. 

Chris Roberts  18:19

That's a beautiful image. That is, that's a beautiful image. 

Kristina Kaiser  18:23

And it's very vivid. I typically forget my dreams, but this one has remained.

Chris Roberts  18:30

Well, thank you for sharing. That was, that was awesome.

Kristina Kaiser  18:35

Thank you for doing this.