Ep. 2 Finding New Life in Old Traditions

Feeling like your spiritual life nees a pick-me-up?

It may be that what we need isn't something entirely new, but rather something "old." Join us as we talk about the ways in which each of us has welcomed new-to-us traditions that are bringing us a sense of grounding and connection we hadn't even known was possible. 

Additional Resources:
The Great Emergence by Phyllis Tickle
Centering Prayer | Rev. Cynthia Bourgeault | 2017 Festival of Faiths
The Daily Examen | Ignatian Spirituality
Sleeping with Bread by Dennis Linn

#SpiritualDirection
#LifeCoaching
#Consolations
#Desolations
#Examen 
#Chant

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Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

life, practice, chant, prayer, spiritual direction, coaching, culture, listening

Dominic Kaiser  00:06

Welcome to The Contemplative Life: Three pastors, friends and spiritual companions help us explore spirituality through a contemplative lens:

I'm Christina Roberts.
I'm Chris Roberts.
I'm Kristina Kaiser. We're glad you joined us.

Christina Roberts  00:23

Hi, it's great to be with you. Today we're going to talk about how to find new life in old traditions. And I'd like to start our conversation with a quote from Phyllis Tickle. She says this: Every 500 years, the church goes through a rummage sale and cleans out the old forms of spirituality, and replaces it with new ones. This does not mean that previous forms become obsolete or invalid. It simply means they lose pride of place as the dominant form of Christianity. 

And actually, the three of us had the opportunity to hear Phyllis teach before she passed away. And as I was listening to her describe this idea of going through the attic to get rid of junk that the church has accumulated over the years and how, in that process, we discover treasures, I was really drawn to this analogy and have used it quite a bit in my life. And I think in addition to what I want to get rid of and what I want to keep, I also find myself drawn to the idea of: What does it mean to upcycle? Right, so even in practical lives, sometimes we have an old item that, you know, a fresh coat of paint, or some other touch up, allows me to then engage with it again in a new way. 

And I find that to be true in my own life with old traditions in Christianity. Some things, you know, I'm fine moving on from. They really don't have life anymore. But I think others, just, a fresh take somehow helps me to engage. So we want to talk today about this idea of where each of us have found new life in the ancient parts of our faith traditions.

Kristina Kaiser  02:00

I like what you're saying, Christina, because I feel like, if I reflect on my own experience, my historical memory feels really short, actually. There's very little that I grew up knowing about or being told about. So as I've gotten into my adult life a little bit, there's kind of been this urge to go back and to look and see what else is there. So I feel very motivated. And obviously we were both at that conference where we got to hear about the 500 year re-awakening/reimagining stuff that can happen. 

So I can think, in my own experience, one of the ways that this has worked out: I was perusing YouTube, actually, I think you may well have sent me the link to this, it was very helpful. And this woman, Cynthia Bourgeault, was teaching on this kind of chant practice that uses one verse. So she was using Psalm 46:10: Be still and know that I am God. So she goes through the whole thing, which I found so bold, first of all. Usually, if you see videos, there's not a lot of silence. People are super-engaged. There's lots of pictures. She even takes, like, 15 minutes in a video to just be, which I thought was so brave. But in this particular moment, she does: Be still and know that I am God. And then the phrase gets shorter and shorter and shorter until you just get to: Be. 

So I started practicing this. And we have a busy life! I have a busy life. Things are always moving and churning. And so I've found, particularly when I get to sing it, I don't always get to sing it. Sort of like one-note, chant, if you will. And one note chant...I was an opera singer. One-note chant is like the opposite of opera. It's like the beginning of all singing the one-note chant. But it turns out that your face will vibrate, and it's very calming, very soothing. And it helps me to literally get to that space of "just be." You don't have to be anything. You don't have to strive for anything right now. You can just receive. You can just exist. So this one has been very helpful. And I will pull it out now, and that muscle memory in a way, even if I can't sing it, because it's the middle of the night, and I would wake my husband up or something, that muscle memory will still be there. And I can still get the effects of what would happen if I was chanting. So that's one that comes to mind for me.

Christina Roberts  04:28

It's interesting that you mention chanting. I have another friend who grew up Lutheran, and she has been returning back to this idea of chanting the Psalms. And I think hearing her and also hearing you right now, it's very interesting because I grew up Greek Orthodox, and we used to have, kind of, before the Divine Liturgy, there was what was called the Orthos. And it was essentially just a handful of old Greek men. And we had one lady that was allowed to be a chanter, and I always wanted to skip the Ortho because it was an hour of just chanting, and that was not my cup of tea at all. And so I appreciated the liturgy part, but definitely was not upset when we had to miss the Orthos. And so it's really interesting, hearing for both you and my other friend, that there's something about the ancient chanting that is really resonating with two of my modern friends. So I really appreciate that, that is something that you've been able to quote "upcycle" in your own?

Chris Roberts  05:23

Well, as I think back to my faith tradition, I think one of the values was prayer. And I came from a charismatic tradition where prayer was this bold - the louder, the more exuberant you got, the better the prayer was. And so I got turned off from prayer for a while. And whenever we were newly married, Christina, you know, I would hear these these comments from people: Families that pray together, stay together. And so this idea of praying even with my spouse was, like, "Oh, I don't really want to do that." 

And so, I think I just went through this time period, where I didn't want to pray. I was just turned off by the prayer practices that I experienced in life. And so I don't even know when I heard about it, but I heard about the Ignatian practice of the Examen. And it's this prayer practice where you sort of go through your day and you think, "Okay, where was God's presence at?" And they would typically call that "the constellation," where you experienced God. And so, I would name that and thank God and pray for those things. 

And then I would go through the desolation, the times where I didn't experience God. And oftentimes my consolation and desolation were linked together. And so there was this theme emerging from this practice of the Examen in my own life, this deep thing that I was examining. And so prayer took on a completely different form. And it brought a lot of great things. It is still my favorite prayer practice today. So I think of reaching back to the Ignatian practice of the Examen, which, was probably developed in the 1500s sometime. So that's reaching quite a ways back.

Kristina Kaiser  07:44

That is a good one. And I first ran into that through this book, "Sleeping with Bread," and I continue to come back to it as well throughout...all the time, actually. Throughout nothing. Jut plain all the time. Because there is this meaningfulness to, especially stopping for my consolation, for sure. But one thing that I learned in that book around the desolations was: It can give you information about yourself, like what you really feel called to. And it can help you channel towards the things that you need to go towards. So I also like that prayer practice.

Christina Roberts  08:23

Well, one of the things that I like to do is look at what are the current trends happening in culture? And how does that tie back to some of the ancient practices? And I have noticed, I listen to various podcasts, and I was reading about the Life Coaching industry. And I think in 2018, it had reached to a billion dollar industry. So very rapidly growing industry over the past probably decade. And so I find myself drawn and fascinated about: What is it about "life coaching" that really seems to resonate with the wider culture these days? 

And so again, looking back to some of the, quote, "roots" of that, and really being drawn to the ancient practice of spiritual direction, and how, back in the day, these Catholic priests and nuns, when they would go out and do ministry, do missions work, they had someone to whom they could talk to about the ministry and what they were experiencing, as they were doing the work of the gospel in these various areas. And so I appreciate this model of "attending to the inner soul," having space for deep listening. And again, the beautiful roots that came from these ancient traditions from, primarily, the Catholics, I believe, started this practice years ago. And even seeing how, now, the modern twist on that with life coaching has really taken off. 

And so I've been spending some time in my own life, trying to understand the difference between those two things. I think that certainly there's a lot of crossover, but there's definitely some differences that those two things have to offer. So I would say that that's something that I'm very intrigued about is: Continuing to learn about spiritual direction, or, some people call it "spiritual companionship" because again, I think in our modern culture, the word "direction" sounds directive, like you're telling me what to do. Where really it's not that. It's drawing out where the person's at, so even kind of seeing the nuance of the language around that. So I would say that that's definitely an old practice that I'm engaging with in a new way.

Chris Roberts  10:20

Yeah, where can you go to tell your own story, whether it's life coaching or spiritual direction, and someone just listens to you? For 30 minutes, you know, Nobody really is able to just talk a monologue for 30 minutes to another person. So I think spiritual direction/life coaching are great for our society because it helps us, sort of, know our own story. I think, one of the major problems with individuals today is: They don't even know their own story. They're just continuing to go through life. And they're not taking the time to reflect on how the events in their life are emerging to this one thing that needs to happen, that needs to come up. Because oftentimes, we keep doing the same experience over and over, expecting these different results. So I love life coaching and spiritual direction simply for that reason. 

Kristina Kaiser  11:25

Oh, yeah, yeah, I feel like there are so many jumbles of thoughts that can be running through the head, right? And they'll just keep bouncing with no particular direction. And when I first started with coaching type stuff, I remember thinking, "This is hard! I just want somebody to tell me what to do!" It is it is work, right, to actually say, "If I could do anything, if I could narrow it down, what direction would I take," but having somebody asked these thoughtful questions has been such a motivator. I feel so much clearer, like, "Okay, I have a purpose. I have a direction I'm going there. It is good." Hence, I suppose spiritual direction. 

But I do like what you're saying about, "it's somebody coming alongside of you, just listening and being there for you." Which I think you're right, Chris. Right? It is difficult to get that. I mean, most Saturday mornings in this house, I try to take some time for that kind of a thing. And eventually, Dominic will say to me, "I am done, I can't do this anymore." [laughing] So yes, very helpful.

Christina Roberts  12:31

Yeah, and I think in all of these practices that we mentioned, today, there's this element of pause, there's an element of peeling away from the noise of the world, peeling away from the noise of our own minds and spirits. And whether it's being attentive to what five or six simple words, of the "Be still and know that I am God," or being attentive to those consolations and desolations in our day, and really thinking through, reviewing our day, because, again, I don't think that we necessarily pause. We just, "Okay, it's time for bed," and then you go on to the next day. Or that deep listening of the soul, where, maybe at the end of the time, there's no conclusion, there's no next step, none of that. But someone held my story and didn't make me feel rushed and honored whatever it is going on in me for those moments of time, which, I think, I really appreciate that in our fast-paced culture, there's a sense of stability and groundedness and slow that it seems like these older practices offer us.

Kristina Kaiser  13:31

I think, if there was just one thing that I would continue to...because I love what you're saying about "all of these help to slow us down." And Dominic will sometimes say, if I've never woken up in the night, I really struggle to get back to sleep. And he will say, "You need to stop. I can hear you thinking." And so things like, "Be still and know that I am God," if I were to just "pray your prayers," right, "pray, the things that are on your mind," that would actually rile me up. It would be the opposite of getting me to a space where I can sleep. So yeah, that has been part of the benefit. We tend to have a lot flying around in there, and we need a way to settle it. So I guess that would be...it's not really an additional thought so much as yes, and yes.

Christina Roberts  14:30

Well, this is the part of our podcast where we want to talk about what we are into this week.

Chris Roberts  14:38

Well, I have been into SodaStream. I have a friend who...she makes fun of me and she says that I like to be special and that I have special pins and special drink makers. And so she couldn't believe that I didn't have a SodaStream. And so she actually bought me one for Christmas. And so I actually have gotten into it, you know. It's this little bottle, you fill up with water and you carbonate it yourself. And then you can add lemon extract or orange extract. And I can't wait to get into, like, lavender or some some edible essential oils in the future. So I've really been into my SodaStream maker 

Kristina Kaiser  15:29

That is exciting.

Christina Roberts  15:32

So I, this week, I am into the Dollar Tree. My children had a four-day weekend. And so we went to the Dollar Tree on Monday afternoon. And each of the kids got X amount of dollars to buy crafty sort of items, or, you know, something that struck them. And it was so fun watching my children, each of their personalities come out in the Dollar Tree store. And it's amazing what you can get for $1. And I had one child, she wanted to decorate her ceiling. And so we ended up with these flowers. And we found these different tomato trellis things that we were able to reconfigure into some cool ceiling thing. My other daughter, wanting to make gifts for somebody else, so bought some paints and whatnot. And then my son's really into numbers. And they had these gigantic calculators, and he saw that and was like, "Oh, wow!" I mean, just in awe! And so I just thought you know, the Dollar Tree brings us such delight, and for a few bucks, they played all afternoon into the next day with these different items. And it was well worth it. So I am grateful for the Dollar Tree.

Kristina Kaiser  16:40

I love it. Oh my gosh, so much joy. I think what I'm into this week is light. So we're new to being in Central Wisconsin after, like, 18 years of being in New England. And New Englanders frequently complain that the sun does not shine enough. But they do not know how much the sun can not shine. Oh my gosh. So we had left our Christmas tree up extra long, but eventually it felt wrong to leave it at any longer, so we took it down. But a friend has mailed us some lights to maybe put up, and so, there's a little bit of light coming through your window, Christina, and I am obsessed with it because, I'm telling you the sun started to rise, and there was this beautiful pink in the world. And then the clouds were like, "Not today!" and they just shut it down. So anything that is bright and warm and beautiful, I am soaking it in with everything in me, every time, even that small little square of light behind you.

Christina Roberts  17:41

I love it. I am sitting in a basement so there's very little light. I'm glad that you can appreciate it. 

Well thanks for joining us on today's podcast. If you want to hear more about how to connect or some more resources, we invite you to check out thecontemplativelife.net. And until then, make it a great week.