Ep 28 Contemplative Storytelling

Today we talk about our stories, why they matter and how we’re changed as we interact with both our own stories and the stories of others.

As it turns out, research and experience show that sharing our stories helps us overcome pain, adversity, and struggle. But sadly, many of us suffer from the inability to even know what our story is. In this episode, we’ll explore a few ways to get back in touch with all of that as well as take some time to talk about what it takes to accept even the parts of our stories we don’t like as much.

#HolyListening
#Reflection
#Evolving
#Alexithymia 

Additional Resources:
Book: Joy Unspeakable by Barbara A. Holmes
Book: Undrowned by Alexis Pauline Gums

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Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

story, storytelling, evolving, timeline, contemplative, reflect

Dominic Kaiser  00:06

Welcome to The Contemplative Life: Three pastors, friends and spiritual companions help us explore spirituality through a contemplative lens.

I'm Christina Roberts.

I'm Chris Roberts.

I'm Kristina Kaiser. We're glad you joined us.

Christina Roberts  00:24

Hello, it is great to be with you. Today we will be talking about our stories, why our stories matter, and how we are changed as we interact with the stories of others. 

I've had a few opportunities in my life to do, what I would call, a deep dive into my story. And the first time was several years ago at a retreat. We were invited before the retreat to create a timeline of our life, sort of as prep work. And then, at the retreat, we were given space for personal reflection about our timeline, followed by an opportunity to share with a triad in a practice called "Holy Listening." And the basic idea is that these two other people listen to you share, without interruption, and then, at the end, you're invited to jot down what you noticed as you heard someone share your story and then to offer those reflections. 

And I have to say, it was a very moving experience for me, and so much so that I ended up sharing that opportunity with a contemplative cohort that I was leading a couple of years after that. So the cohort was a year long, and, by far, the feedback was that, that was one of the favorite sessions, this sharing of stories. 

Since then, I've had two other times to share my story in this deep way, which I'll talk about more in a moment. But I wonder, what is it about stories that are so moving and matter? I know, for me, I've heard a lot of sermons in my life, and I don't know that I can necessarily recount the scriptural basis. But boy! I remember stories years after the fact; there's something about that, that sticks and resonates. And so I wonder why you guys think we get so much meaning and why stories are important.

Kristina Kaiser  02:05

Yes, I have enjoyed storytelling throughout my experience as well. And it's a good question: Why? Why does that matter so much? And it's probably a different answer from one person to the next. But as I think about my own life, I think: Well, I tend not to reflect,? I go, go go. And I leave all my emotions behind because they're not productive, and they're not efficient. And so, until I really sit down, I feel like I don't necessarily see connections in my life; I don't really process what's happened. I tend to externally process like, I love to talk things through. But it can get really broad, and we can end up somewhere else by the end. So a little bit of focus, like: What has happened? And then what has happened? And how do these things connect...seems to be really meaningful. So I, too, when I teach classes, I find some of my favorite ones are the nights where we wrote down a few of our stories, we shared them, people reflected back to us. Those are really powerful moments. I'm with you.

Chris Roberts  03:10

Yeah, I think what comes up for me with storytelling is an experience that I had listening to an author, many years ago, talk about his memoir, and talking about books in general. And he was sort of a proponent for everyone reading literature. And he said: The thing about reading literature is, you're faced with a choice of either becoming empathetic with the story, empathetic with individuals, or you just sort of become hardened. Those are, sort of, the two choices that you have. And so I've really appreciated that over the years because I've started this journey of taking in a lot more literature. And hearing other people's stories, I think, has made me more of a compassionate person towards the human story in general. And that's what I really have appreciated about storytelling.

Christina Roberts  04:16

Yeah, I think it's interesting, because the first time that I did this in-depth storytelling, it was more chronologically based, and what were the major moments in my life, and, you know, to your point, Kristina, seeing the connections. Obviously, I've lived my story, but there's something about recounting it to others that don't know you. You begin to see themes and patterns that, when you're articulating that, you otherwise would maybe miss.

But I think in subsequent times when I've had an opportunity to share, one time was a deep dive into one aspect of my story. And I actually spent months excavating these different memories and portions of my story, and it was very cathartic for me. And then about a month ago, I had an opportunity to, also in a contemplative space, to share my story, and it was an Interesting what I chose to leave out of the story this time. I'm evolving, and even the way in which I'm sharing my story is evolving. And I don't necessarily feel the need to recount so much of, maybe, my past decades. And so I  acknowledge: These things happened, but my starting point is going to be here. And I want to actually focus on this part of my story in a new way. So that was interesting for me personally, to kind of notice how that storytelling has evolved in my life.

Kristina Kaiser  05:26

Whoo, this theme of evolving has come up in previous podcasts! When we talked about Vocational Discernment, we talked about how "maybe we change, and this is what has allowed us to move." So this is interesting that it's coming up again with storytelling, and it reminds me a little bit of when I was going through this book, "Joy Unspeakable," they talked about the "grioche," (and I have no idea if that's how you pronounce it," but the storytellers, in the community, that would keep it alive...and how, even in our modern day world, songs tell the story of the people today. And even in genres that maybe are less respected...Kids don't always have the struggle respecting it...But just that act of telling the story. 

So, yes! I think we tend to find ways to get the story out whether it's song, which is interesting, because when we started thinking about this topic, I noted, I have been playing around with movement as a way to tell my story. So it's during some of my meditation times my sit times, I'll realize: Oh, I just I feel restless today. Right? And so rather than be still, I'll move, and it's really fun. What does the body decide to do? Why did my body decide to turn? I didn't anticipate turning, my body just did. Why did my body turn? And then: What would happen if I turn again? Does it feel right to turn again or not? And what do all these things mean? So I find sometimes, even the telling of the story through movement is what allows me to become still after the fact. So I don't know. A few more thoughts... 

Christina Roberts  07:18

Yeah, and even you kind of mentioning the Vocational Discernment that we've been reflecting on in past podcasts, I think, after this first initial time with the storytelling, I sort of geeked out on this idea of timelines and our stories. And as I was meeting with people, so if I was meeting with someone about, maybe, finances...in my church role, I would ask them: Tell me your story about what were finances like as a kid? What was your first job? And narrating the story of finances.

Or, vocation is another one: Tell me about your jobs. What what his vocation looked like in your life? I even heard someone the other day actually talking about movement. And they were trying to get more, quote, "healthy" in their in their life, and it was really helpful to kind of reflect on: What has movement and health look like for me? And what had been the up-points and down-points of that journey? And so I think that there's so many different ways that you can take this idea of storytelling, and being vulnerable, and reflecting a little bit deeper on these things, again, that we just otherwise might be passing by.

Chris Roberts  08:14

Yeah, I've appreciated what, what's come up today. It seems like we're talking about our own story, but we're also talking about how we intersect with the story of others. And I really have appreciated intersecting with other people's stories. But I think this whole contemplative thing has also been important for me in order to become aware of my own story. And I like the things that you touched on earlier about our stories evolving. And I think I'm definitely experiencing that right now. 

I, probably a number of years ago, did that timeline exercise where I looked at my timeline. And I was super impacted by...I never even left the age of five. My timeline that I focused on was like, strictly from the time that I was born to five-years old and how much God was in the first years of my life. And the theme was shame, the experience of shame, and how that moved into me being a redemptive person in the lives of many other people. And I think that was super powerful for that time in my life. 

But now, if I were to sit down and do a timeline, I don't think that would be what comes up. It's interesting that vocation, you know, we've talked about vocation and what are things that are coming up? "How are you being an influence in the world," is sort of what is in my timeline right now. And that's how it's evolving. 

So I like how we're talking about paying attention to our own story and how important that is, but also how we intersect with other people's stories. 

But I was talking to an individual the other day, and I think sometimes if we're struggling with our own story, other people's stories can sort of be confusing, right? Because then this there's this comparison that happens. And so that was what was happening in our conversation. There's all these comparisons about other people's stories, like how God moved. And so I was able to say, "This is your story right now, and maybe some more attention could be given to your exact story rather than bring in all the other stories around you." 

So I think, if you're experiencing confusion with your own story, sometimes intersecting with other people's stories can actually be counterproductive to that process. And so I think that's one thing that is being highlighted as we have this conversation.

Christina Roberts  10:41

Yeah, I think that's important to name. I think sometimes as we are taking deep dives into our stories, there can be a sense of regret, like maybe we're looking at our choices that we made, and we think: Oh!...And it's hard, because who we are now isn't who we used to be five years ago. And so we didn't know what we know. And so looking back, it can be like: Oh, man, I missed the boat on this! Or: Had somebody told me this, this could have gone this way. 

And really, sitting with people and saying: The story has evolved, how it has. And to accept all aspects of our story, and to be able to integrate that, I think, is a really important piece. So I think that's great, Chris, of naming: Sometimes there is that coming into it. And that's okay. We can process that. We can sit with that. And we can somehow invite God to integrate those things to help us to be present to who we are in this moment.

Kristina Kaiser  11:29

I was recently talking with an old friend of mine; it was so much fun to talk to her! She's done a lot of work with movement and social justice. And so she mentioned a book, and I've totally forgotten the name of the book, but the author's last name was Gums. And I can find the name of the book to put in the comments later on. But this movement lady who wrote this book talks about the dorsal fin on the shark, and how the fin evolved. So it wasn't always there. And why did it evolve, and they decided that it's because of all the turbulent waters. It's this topsy-turvy experience. And then, just the reality of it was: The water was never going to be perfectly calm. And so the body needed to adapt. 

So this notion of "evolving," feels very similar. We're always going to have these changes in our oneself. Our body has to find a way to be in these waters that we're in. And I feel like the storytelling can help us do that, right? It helps us with that awareness. It kind of centers us, helps us become a little bit still. 

And to your guys' points too, that question of: What was, for instance, finances like as a child? That totally plays in, right?! How we are feeling today is often related to something that might have got stuck. And my friend talks about that, too. She is more... she understands her body way more than probably I'll ever understand it, because she went to school for dance. And she's a Pilates instructor. She just majors in it, right. But she talks about this moment where she was doing something and she just knew that something was stuck on one side of her body, that she pressed on her head and it didn't move the way she would expect it to. And then she could move through that with her own self. So I do think that there is something to this awareness, however it comes, whether it's storytelling, or some other way. Evolution of our own story, the whole bit seems like a really big piece.

Christina Roberts  13:27

Yeah, and I think that that's interesting, Kristina, about where our stories live within, even, our physical beings and our bodies, and certain aspects of our story that may be a little stuck in there, and being able to excavate out those things. But then I think it's also  important to name the interweaving of our stories, and that there's something about gaining strength from another, or gaining perspective, not feeling alone when you hear someone else's story, even if it's a totally different story than yours, but maybe that person experience grief and you experience grief. And it's different styles of grief or types of grief. But that doesn't matter. Because in that moment, you just need to know that: I'm not alone on this planet, that our stories are inter woven through those pieces. 

And what comes to mind is this verse in the book of Revelation, and it talks about: They overcame by the blood of the lamb and the word of their testimony, which is this striking verse! But the idea of "the word of their testimony," or in other words, stories, and there's something about sharing stories that helps us to overcome some of our our own pain, our own adversity, our own struggles and sharing that with others seems to be very important.

Chris Roberts  14:31

Yes, I totally agree with you. I was listening to a podcast recently and this huge word was lifted up and the word is alexithymia. Alexithymia is really the "inability to know your own story." And they're talking about how many Americans suffer, like one of the things that we talked about while ago, is things being stuck in our own body. They said that it's almost an epidemic that people are just so out of touch with their own stories. And so I think that's one of the things that comes to mind as we're talking, this idea of alexithymia.

Christina Roberts  15:12

Well, if anyone here listening and resonates with alexithymia, we would love to invite you to reach out to us to share your story. We would love to set up a session with you one-on-one or in a triad setting if that seems like something that would be helpful for you. So thanks so much for this conversation today. And three cheers for stories and why they matter!

Well, this is the part of our podcast where we talk about what we are into this week.

Kristina Kaiser  15:44

So I think that I am into changing up breakfast. You know, I feel like you can get into the same thing all the time. And we were recently away. And so our kids, while we were away, got super into English muffins, which is such a shock! English muffins were never my favorite. I don't know if it's the butter that made them excited or what. So when we went, when we got back, we went to the store and we got different kinds of bread and English muffins. And I got into smoothies and I'm on again-off again with smoothies, but I really enjoyed them. So we got stuff for that. So it's all about changing our breakfast right now!

Chris Roberts  16:20

Well I have been into storytelling while carpooling. Our kids are doing various camps over the summer, and my middle daughter is at a camp on the east side of town and my son is at an Vacation Bible School on the west side of town. And my older daughter does not want to miss the opportunity to ride along to hear good stories and tell good stories. And so we've had a lot of fun this week just talking about life and talking about the things that are happening in our different worlds. Or even bringing up stories from my childhood, she has asked me about those as well. So I am about carpooling and storytelling this week.

Christina Roberts  17:03

So thematic. I love it. So I am into part two of vacation planning. So at the beginning of the summer, we just got back from a trip seeing two of my siblings and then we are getting ready to leave to see two of my other two siblings in a couple of weeks. And we have my sister-in-law coming in between that. So all about family and planning and thinking of the fun little day trips and all the fun little, "Oh, let's try this place in this place," which is super fun. And I really missed that during the pandemic last year. So I am into part two of vacation planning. 

Well As always, it was great to be with you today. We would love it, if you are enjoying this podcast, and I know this can be a big ask, but if you would be willing to rate and review our podcast, it really helps others to find us. So if you do that, we would be oh so grateful. Other than that, we welcome you to check out thecontemplativelife.net for upcoming events or to reach out to us personally. Until then, make it a great week. See you next time.